音樂的感染力是非常重要的
也就是為什麼T.M.在設計產品時，入門的雖然規格沒有辦法達到頂級產品的要求，但都具有一定的音樂性，愉快的享受，才會有更輕鬆的滿足感:P
引用:
作者: lyyoung
可列印查看
音樂的感染力是非常重要的
也就是為什麼T.M.在設計產品時，入門的雖然規格沒有辦法達到頂級產品的要求，但都具有一定的音樂性，愉快的享受，才會有更輕鬆的滿足感:P
引用:
作者: lyyoung
左右聲道完全分離的L1.5前級引用:
作者: 小葉
等級當然在只有一個VR的L2.5之上( L1.5 "0" cross-talk in channel separation)
而Caspian系列前級電源並無分離(包含Caspian Platinum)
聽說將來的旗艦型號是L7
但是開發過程碰到成本太高的問題故難產
現在的白金系列是現行最高型號
可以說已經在這個成本價位中很努力做出來的好產品
但M型消費型態中 中價位產品定位困難
這可以說是白金系列推展最困難的問題
但接下來的白金系列CDP還是讓人期待的.....:D
感染力太高有人會嫌透明度不足引用:
作者: 小葉
增加了太多"東西"
所以會有上面的＂豐富 ＶＳ. 透明＂的看法
要透明，依據經驗，系統要有一定的層級以上可能比較有辦法 :|
引用:
作者: lyyoung
沒錯!但是一直升級和調整增加透明度也是個迷思引用:
作者: 小葉
過猶不及
失去了令人如臨現場和聆聽環境空間一起互動的感受
只是聽到麥克風收錄的(純粹單體發出的)聲音
其實是缺了一些真實感的!:)
偏好中高頻或是高音的好音質
不可忘記音樂的"形體感"---"body"的重要
有形無體是不夠完整的....:)
完整豐富的下盤非常重要!
好的下盤應該是控制力好,音場就好 就有層次分明.如果是低音量過大則是有問題.
所以這就是調音的重要和我強調低音量感可調的方便性的原因引用:
作者: harrisonlin
量過大會"轟"產生駐波聲音透明度就會變差
我倒覺得要有足夠的低音量再做一些吸音擴散
量感不足上面提到的一些問題就會浮現....
TMS3-an auditioning report
http://www.roksan.co.uk/forum/viewt...a869a02d45336ae
Dear forum members
I went on a factory visit at Roksan at the end of December, and had the honour of an "ante-prima" audition of the TMS3. The TT was introduced to me by nobody else than Touraj, who gave me an in-depth technical lecture on what is special about Roksan TT's and the TMS3 in particular. Here I would like to share my experience with you. I had no opportunity to compare it with the TMS2, but what I heard left a lasting impression on me.
We did the audition in a small room, that is equipped for testing purposes only, so not dealer showroom or anything like that. The TT was connected via the DS1.5 Reference DC Power supply and the ARTAXERXES.X Reference phono stage (one box) to Roksan's Platinum series pre & power combo, Shiraz cartridge, Artemiz2 arm. The speakers were small bookshelf format Kandys. Touraj was doing tests on the Kandys so the frequency splitter was outside the speaker case and a soldering iron next to it... quite an improvised setup.
To begin with the TMS3 looks like the old TMS1, plain black, no sparkly silver dots like the TMS2 outer look. The TT was standing on a glass shelf. We listened to three LP's
Ray Charles: Genius needs company
Yello: The flag
Lauryn Hill: Unplugged
Touraj explained the special decoupling mechanisms, which have been developed to separate the actual platter and the arm board from the underlying supports and that are common to all TMS TTs from what I understood. The basic design philosophy is to maximize the signal to noise ratio (s/n) as much as possible. As you move up the ladder from the Radius to the TMS, the s/n ratio increases, but the basic design principles remain the same. They just become more advanced as you go higher, not principally different.
To reduce the s/n ratio a TT should ideally be constructed like a pyramid, with a series of layers, each one designed to further decouple itself from the underlying one, be it the platter, motor plinth, the arm board, another plinth, a wall shelf or any sort of support.
Each material/support/shelf has its own oscillation frequencies. When the stylus reads the signal form the groove, a resonance between the eigenfrequencies of the support and the signal picked up by the stylus could occur. This introduces spurious noise and degrades the music signal (lowering the signal to noise ratio) which goes to the amplifier. The design of the TMS is conceived to absolutely minimize this sort of interference by all means. The advanced decoupling mechanisms prevent a resonance between single structural elements, which could be transmitted to the turning platter and pollute the music signal sensed by the stylus. There are technical design details such as the external metal ring on the outer platter, which linearly dampens oscillations of the platter.
In the TMS3 some of these design details have been further elaborated to increase the s/n ratio. This is achieved by paying meticulous attention to the precision with which the parts are machined and assembled. New suppliers are found that are able to deliver parts such as spindles and bearings with even less tolerance because they have special machinery to produce the moving parts with even higher precision (at a higher cost of course).
Touraj also mentioned that the feet of the TT have been improved, allowing to position the TT also on a glass surface. Special silicon insulators prevent that eigenfrequencies of a glass surface could be transmitted to other parts of the TT.
After this technical intro and some details about how the Artemiz arm is designed (issues related to the unavoidable compromise between linear bearings used by LP manufacturers for cutting the record v.s. rotary bearing used in retrieving the signal by the tonearm) , we listened to the test LP's. Even though we used entry-level speakers, the sound was absolutely natural, very analytical I'd say, not forgiving by all means. What is in the groove is what you get, an implicit design criterion.
In designing a TT, Touraj starts form the basic question: what is a TT supposed to do? "To retrieve a signal from a groove in the most undistorted and pure way possible, and to transmit it to amplification". The TMS3 excels in doing this. The music is reproduced so as it has been recorded and cut into the master record, nothing else. If the system does something wrong, you will hear it.
I was drawn into the music, listening to the voice of Ray Charels or Lauryn Hill, as if they were standing in front of me. Rather difficult to reproduce in words.
At the end Touraj told me that the TMS3 is already on its way out of the factory, as there is demand from traditional strong vinyl markets such as Japan, Singapore or Hong Kong.
This is my summary of the visit. I left the place quite impressed, by the quality of what I have heard as well as by the dedication and design consistency with which this equipment is build. Design at Roksan is driven by passion for music.
Best regards
Paolo
Last edited by pippo on Mon Jan 14, 2008 6:39 pm; edited 3 times in total
"Design at Roksan is driven by passion for music."
You can always feel the passion of the music that you are listening to.
That is why the owners of Roksan system all have large collections of records and cds.
It's always the music that really matters!:)
玩聲音其實主要就是在玩震動的控制
這句話我覺得大多數的情況下都適用
用好的音響架和墊材來減振會提高聲音的品質
話說我今天年終大掃除
就把音響架拆掉重新組合
除了清潔擦拭保養鎖緊之外
也在角錐下加上BDR
果然有效!:)
看來接下來要上BDR的板子了 :P
引用:
作者: lyyoung
這鍋可能比我器材貴耶!引用:
作者: 小葉
不符比例原則
不如直上ASR!!
But not now, and perhaps no need!:D:D
只能說習慣聽LP的自然表現方式
CD自然就會少聽了
未轉製成CD的LP版本太多了吧
繁不勝舉
來貼些唱片封面吧
第一二張是德國private records當然沒CD發行
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/1...ords011yo6.jpg
http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/5...ords012gz8.jpg
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/5...ords013kn3.jpg
http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/8...ords014bh7.jpg
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/5...ords009or8.jpg
聽不出版本或器材墊材的差異自然不必花那個錢也是件好事
所以一聽就分辨出來那就慘了!
上面第一二張是輕鬆愉悅優美的室內樂音樂會私人錄音
第三張單聲道唱片更是LP的強項
第四張是我聽過速度最快的版本
可能和剛加上的墊材有關聯
第五張是極超值附贈約翰受難曲的巴赫小提琴無伴奏
買起來可能都比CD便宜!
音質上CD只有"乾淨"上勝出
音樂上則是沒得比的
有些許雜音根本無損於聆樂...(通常是沒有啦)
其實CD也可以很好，只是在音樂性方面，LP通常比較容易達到 8)
許多朋友已經將數位音樂改成以電腦存取播放有聲音就好(其實聲音也還不錯)引用:
作者: 小葉
要認真聽音樂還是聽LP
我覺得不失為一個sensible solution
同時買LP和CD太傷了也有空間不足的問題
硬碟的空間可以非常非常大又便宜...
Music Server也是High End廠的一種趨勢，看來CD不斷的面臨挑戰...
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/9...0207002dd5.jpg
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/2...0207003vi7.jpg
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/5...0207004lt0.jpg
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/6...0207005mv7.jpg
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/9...0207006sl7.jpg
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/8...0207007cq5.jpg http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/7...0207008an3.jpg
相信聽音樂聽久的人多少會去聽更早期的錄音
撇開原本就錄不好的唱片不說
如果手上同時有同一個版本stereo和mono的版本來互做比較
就可以發現單聲道唱片聲音飽滿細節更多的特點
CD的轉錄者若是刻意用EQ等化去消去一些雜音
會造成另一種數位的特有的噪訊
今天下午chinchin兄來訪
後來我就刻意播放一些單聲道的唱片
chinchin兄果然是喜歡mono的版本
我們後來決定要繼續去找十吋的老唱片
因為聲音好又便宜
附帶提一下我的聲音因為音響架鎖緊並加上BDR後果然是有進步的
鋼琴顆粒的形體更清晰質感更好
弦樂聲音更綿密耐聽
但是也有缺點就是片子的狀況更容易聽出來是否髒了或有受傷
這也是兩難啦
要解析好又要片片好聽是不可能的
Anyway我還是肯定這個調整帶來的改善
因為我的mono唱片變得非常好聽
好的立體或數位錄音就不必說了
貼一下幾張今天聽的唱片:
http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/4...0208001zk5.jpg
http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/2...0208002iu3.jpg
http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/2...0208003vr7.jpg
http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/5...0208004ht6.jpg
http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/3...0208005nm4.jpg
今晚有貴客帶著他的金耳朵來助我調音
先拿掉後牆一些吸音物質
增加中高頻光澤
再微調喇叭和後牆的距離以及toe-in角度
音域平衡和定位又準確了很多
據貴客表示線材和墊材可再調整一番
朋友們下次來當有另一番感受喔!:D
陸老師沒找偶去.......引用:
作者: lyyoung
偶也要跟啦
呵呵!他來得很匆促引用:
作者: alen
下次有機會介紹您認識....:)
新的心得是皮帶.....
我又再試了皮帶翻面和上下倒過來的差異(TM很強調正確set up的重要)
在某些唱片中很明顯聽出較粗糙面接觸帶動platter時會有些躁動感和微微的破
聲
因為用皮帶消除馬達振動的效果未完全達到之故(有些因皮帶紋路造成的振動)
上皮帶時粗糙面比較容易附著在轉盤上而皮帶光滑面比較不容易附著，而這才是對的帶動面！
上下顛倒則是因切割皮帶時的方向所帶來的紋路差異
靜心下來比較真的是有很不同的感受(可以用摩擦兩側方式感受不同，摩擦力小的是對的方向)
方向對了音樂會更加流暢！S/N比明顯會提高
電源線對於音響器材的重要無庸置疑!引用:
作者: lyyoung
但可以調聲是否代表"音染"或是"不衛生"呢?
其實都多慮了!
換過就知道差別在何處!
系統中除了之前小葉兄介紹的線材之外
又嚐試增加了上瑞代理的AudioPlan的電源線!
優質的純銅鍍上厚銀是密技之一
最貴的一條給電源供應器
其他就給LP唱盤電源和二三系統的訊源和轉盤
寧靜度和層次感豐富度都有提升
將來或許有機會再試試昂貴的"香腸"Sausage旗艦電源線吧:)
幾乎跟平價器材一般貴說(sweat)
麻煩lyyoung大大post一下圖:P:P:P
先貼一下抓到的圖
我就是用右邊那條接電源供應器
http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/4...wercordal6.jpg
旗艦"香腸"Clean Cord
http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/2...eancordtn5.jpg
:)
陸大人
千萬別試香腸 100%保證破財
話說回來 要寄幾條呢:*:D:D:D
這般神奇的香腸,有機會也想嘗一嘗..:P引用:
作者: 上瑞張sir
張老師都已經開金口了引用:
作者: 上瑞張sir
就先來上一條給phono stage用用
用完再來報告心得!:D:D
電源是Audioplan強項之一，看來陸老師下一步就是...8)
http://www.audioplan.de/03_produkte/...rod3_sv_13.jpg
http://www.audioplan.de/03_produkte/..._prod3_sv.html
引用:
作者: lyyoung
的確很吸引人!引用:
作者: 小葉
但我下一歩應該是找個單聲道唱頭聽單聲道唱片
我不覺得系統中有很欠缺的東西說
已經很滿足了.....:)
白金版在呼喚 老師..........引用:
作者: lyyoung
聽過啦!應該沒比我的系統更好:)引用:
作者: sp007
Rok系列新旗艦難產(成本壓不下來)
我的還是旗艦啦!
白金只是二當家的等級喔8)
說的沒錯，那麼TM應該是當家了吧...(happy)
TMS系列跟小弟身價不符啦....引用:
作者: 小葉
我認為TMS3絕對有實力和各家最頂級旗艦一爭雄長
在第一級的系統中擔綱演出
我的X20已經近乎TMS2的表現
沒什麼好不滿足的了!:D:D
陸老師太客氣了，香腸到了嗎？:P
引用:
作者: lyyoung
還沒耶!張老師不好意思真的害我吧!呵呵!引用:
作者: 小葉
週末剛去翡翠灣玩回來
還沒跟張老師下訂(以為張老師會寄來說)
明天張老師上班再記得幫我寄上一條
不要客氣了!:)
我想他為了表達"歉意"，會寄兩條過去吧 (giggle)
引用:
作者: lyyoung
買一送一嗎?:D No problem!:o引用:
作者: 小葉
新電源線Audioplan Clean Cord(Sausage)到了立即就接上Roksan Caspian Phono Reference
換下的Leemee211純銀電源線接到唱盤的大電源
立刻覺得聲音的鮮活度又提升了一些
隨著run-in時間的增長
覺得stage width, depth和寧靜度(背景黑)都提高了
機器變壓器的哼聲變得更小了
訊噪比更高!!
好的電源的確對聲音幫助很大....真的是一試就靈!